My oldest daughter can’t complete a sentence without including a “Like”. Annoying as it can be, kind of like fingernails on a chalk board, we don’t find it offensive. On the other hand, just a single “F” word out of her better be the result of a painful event such as stubbing a toe on a table leg.
1 Like
So…I also find the constant “likes” that younger people seem to, erm, like just as annoying. Perhaos not as much a whenever they start to speak, they start with “So”. And then they finish with that rising cadence thing that makes every sentence sound like a question - I hate that one with a vengeance. Give me an F word in preference, every time.
Yours
John "Grumpy Old Man " Harters
3 Likes
Upspeak.
2 Likes
Hi, jfood:
Actually, I’m OK with all words, just not hostile or abusive conduct.
Every time I see one of these discussions, someone intones (in that way to imply there is no questioning it) about how civilization will end without moderation. I guess I don’t get around enough, because I’ve never seen anything on any site resembling anarchy, much less chaos.
I actually would like to see a specially-designated “Speaker’s Arch” board here, where Onions can hold forth completely as they wish, with no mderation at all. They can use ONLY profanity 24/7 for all I care, no holds barred.
This would be an interesting social experiment. Given what think I know about our members, I don’t think going to even this extreme would cause the sky to fall. And the demure, the sensitive, and the PC would know their eyes might get scorched, and not peruse it.
Aloha,
Kaleo
2 Likes
Harters, I guess we get much more of that here in the US. “Like” and the ‘up-talking’, or ‘upspeak’(they’ve actually named it here), are usually limited to the younger set. Interestingly, “so” seems (at least in my limited study of it) to have started with highly educated tech Managers, CEOs, and talking heads. It really bugged me until I realized it’s just a place-holder that is at least more mature sounding than “Ummmm”. Kindof hard to get too upset when one of the most prolific ‘so’ users I’ve heard is someone like Marc Andreessen, the founder of Netscape and a huge tech investor.
I always have to fight the urge to respond with “so is that a statement, or a question?” It’s as though they’re not quite sure of themselves or what they’ve just said, so they’re asking rather than telling.
1 Like
As in “So, it was, like, a salad”. (in whiney upspeak)
Was it a salad or not.
“It’s as though they’re not quite sure of themselves or what they’ve just said, so they’re asking rather than telling.”
But, I would argue, that’s exactly the case. It’s why it’s more common with women than men. The speaker is checking in with her audience to make sure that they DO in fact understand everything that has been said, and to make sure that the audience is still listening and interested. Unlike the speaker who just plows ahead in complete paragraphs whether or not anyone cares or listens or understands.
I understand why it can be annoying for some people but it doesn’t really bother me. Even in Harters’ example below “So, it was, like, a salad” - maybe there was something unusual about the dish that didn’t seem very saladlike to the speaker (i.e., they’d never had larb before, etc.)
1 Like
So you’ve actually got a justification for it? Really? Thousands of Valley Girl TV skit and movie characters have just said “Thank you!”. Is that a slight tug on my leg I feel?
I could be wrong but it seems I first started hearing the “Like” coming from TV shows my girls watched. Maybe something with the “Valley Girl” thing what ever that was?
While I will agree with you that it’s more common with young women than with men, I’ll differ that they are anywhere even remotely checking in to see if the audience understands (because they’re not sure they understand, perhaps?) , nor do they particularly care if their audience is engaged (because their public-speaking skills are not honed enough to make a statement, let alone engage an audience)
I would put it more squarely in the sad category of girls being questioned more on statements of veracity, and being unsure that it’s okay to make a positive/declarative statement.
It’s a salad. With voice dropping at the end, because I believe it to be a salad, that dish that I just consumed, and I’m making that statement.
It’s a salad? With an upvoice, indicating that not only am I not entirely sure what the hell it was I just ate, I’m really not confident enough to make the statement, and I’m wondering if it’s okay to state that I believe it to be a salad.
It makes my heart hurt for these girls, to be honest, because they will never be taken seriously as long as they use the tone “I’m not sure, is that right?” as the unspoken message behind everything they say. My other urge, other than to ask them if they’re asking or telling, is to take them by the arm into a quiet room and give them a pep talk about standing tall and looking their listener in the eye and TELLING them in a clear, declarative tone that THIS is what I am SAYING. That they should have no qualms about saying THIS IS WHAT I KNOW.
“The sky is blue?” is an entirely different utterance than “The sky is blue.”
1 Like
Are you replying with questions because you’re making a joke about uptalk, or because you’re asking me a question?
Of course I was serious. I’d far prefer to talk with someone who is checking in to make sure I’m interested and understand what’s already been said than someone who just needs to hear themselves speak, and just assumes everyone is fascinated.
“The sky is blue?” is an entirely different utterance than “The sky is blue.”
Of course. But the sky can be many different colors at different seasons, places, times of day.
Perhaps the uptalk is not to see if the listener understands, but acknowledges. We’re on the same page? We both know about band camp?
1 Like
And let’s not forget the newest addtion to mis-grammar…
Basically - “It was basically a salad”
Have [insert verb] - “I have earned a degree in astrophysics”
Myself - “please feel free to contact myself”
Interesting…a “No Holds Bar” board where it is TOGWAR (“The Only Game without any Rules” from Bang the Drum Slowly). I was watching West Side Story last night and it could be the rumble under the interstate between the sharks and the jets. Say what you want, personal attacks allowed, any language allowed, no moderation.
Would be interesting internet Caligula.
Past continuous verb forms are mis-grammar?
The first is awkward and a bit weird, but not grammatically incorrect (it’s either a salad or it’s not, but mechanically the sentence is correct.)
The third is flat-out incorrect in any circumstance.
But the middle one is also correct, depending on the context, as it describes what has happened up to the time frame of the context.
I earned a degree in astrophysics in 1985.
I have earned a degree in astrophysics, and am working towards a graduate degree in basketweaving.
@ratgirlagogo – the sky is always blue during daylight hours when seen from the surface of the earth. If the sky is grey, you’re not seeing the sky – you’re seeing the clouds.
(because if we’re going to be pedantic, let’s take it all the way)
5 Likes
(note: no clue found as to how to simply post a message to the topic without it being a “Reply” to some individual. this is my comment to ALL; it is not a reply/insult/written challenge/dis-post to any individual)
I dread climbing back into this topic.
it is amazing curious that the conversation has shifted from “how X should moderation be?”
from the real question:
“how unpleasant should posters be?”
if you read back through this - and others - thread you will find so much unhappiness with over-moderation, locking threads and similar issue. well, guess what - the same is happening here as was so bitterly complained about of CH and oh btw similar issues on FTC.
newsflash: there is a site owner. the owner of the site sets the rules. like 'em or leave 'em - it’s just that simple.
the rule here is a PG-13 environment. if one wishes ala FTC to F-bomb every sentence, every other word of every message - gosh, might not be an appropriate site for one’s participation.
imho, the discussion should not be about which word(s) must be bleeped / banned / edited / moderated / whatever - the discussion would be better focused on acceptable behavior / posting.
not seen site that has issues with poor moderation? yup, you don’t get out much. I’ve seen any number of them - which I would happy link to for edification . . . but they’ve closed, gone bust. is there a message there?
a no-hold-everything-and-anything section? no problem. make it a private section with admission by request only, not publicly visible.
Hooters? seriously? I spent considerable time in the Navy. no too many expletives I’ve missed. the nom-du-jour was “lumped chested sailors” - as to females serving aboard non-combatant support ships. and I’ve witnessed more than one of those lumpy chested sailors who in a half-sentence could cringe a 15 yr. bos’un off the deck. so how does one address it… lumpy chicken parts? lumps of lamb? seriously? an auto-bleeper?
1 Like
It’s the blue “reply” button that you want.
1 Like
No offense. You’re the first person, at least in what I look at as my world, I’ve ever heard defend it, certainly in that way. Isuppose, if what’s being said is really a question, it’s OK to go up that way. It just seems to me that, more often, it’s just a way of speaking… almost like a dialect.
1 Like
