Interesting! I really want to “up” my pickle game.
1 Like
(post deleted by author)
Fermented hot pepper spreads, like sambal oelek, can be done in mason jars, which doesn’t take up much space. I de-seed whatever peppers go into the mix before whizzing them up in a food processor. It helps if one has some fresh or frozen brine from prior ferments to kick-start the process. A tablespoon is usually plenty. Last time, I used a 3%, by weight, salt to mash, and it worked really well.
The Shockey’s books on fermented vegetables are quite good. They have another: Fiery Ferments, which has a bunch of spicy recipes/methods.
2 Likes
Planning to try some half sours inspired by this post
It mentions Persian cucumbers might be easier than Kirby’s. I bought these two types; the ones the right labeled “pickling” at the Mexican market, and I think they are Kirby’s. The others are from the Asian market, and I think they are “Persian”.
The pickling ones fit better, (although this regular mouth jar is probably a mistake) and the Persian ones , which came in a bag, are already getting soft.
I obediently shook up the brine in the plastic container before pouring in the jar.
Any opinions about garlic scapes in the mix? I have some I would like to use.
3 Likes
I think they should be fine…even if they’re not traditional, im guessing they’d add nice flavor.
My memory is dropping little nuggets about the thread…there was a side discussion about putting a grape leaf in the jar because it keeps them crisper.
Found the thread!
Heres more info
GREAT POST! I’ve made traditional fermented pickles a bunch and I was nodding along with most of your tips that I learned through experience. I made homemade pickles, homemade sauerkraut, homemade pastrami (with boneless short ribs, natch), homemade rye bread, and traditional fermented ginger beer for an all fermented (or pickled in the case of the pastrami) meal. So worth the time.
Here are a few tips I’d add for aspiring home fermenters.
To your spice blend I would add coriander seed and not much else. If you can find it (I can’t), then you’ll want to use flowering dill.
The Penzey’s pickling spice is excellent for corned beef/pastrami, I find, but terrible for kosher pickles. Mace and clove really don’t belong at the party, you’re right about that!
I let my pickles ferment at room temp for far longer than you do, to great personal results. The key is to continue to test your pickles after a few days of fermentation and to skim every day. There may be mold or a white yeast the floats to the top but continue to skim it off.
Also, I wouldn’t rely on packing to keep pickles submerged. Instead, find a plate and a place that on top with a jar of water. Much more reliable. Just wash those off every couple of days when skimming/testing.
I cover the whole thing with a double layer of flour sack towels, though an old pillow case would be perfect, too.
The half sour v. full sour pickle actually doesn’t have to depend on time. And in fact, I say it shouldn’t. Instead it should depend on the % of salt in your brine. If you use the correct salt concentration in the brine then your half sours will remain half sours in the refrigerator for a very long time. Otherwise, you’ll eventually get full sour pickles no matter what.
I truly hope more people start making their own fermented products like pickles, 'kraut, and homemade sodas. Thanks to Mr. T for bringing us so much knowledge from this grand tradition.
Permalink | Reply
By cacio e pepe on Sep 2, 2011 11:06 AM
The links should be appearing at the bottom of the page under “Home Cooking Board Discussions.” (I’ve edited the first post to clarify.) I count about five of them at least which have mostly identical recipes, so lots of good resources here for people that are interested in real NYC style sour pickles.
I thought the whole thread was worth reading, not just my posts, so I didn’t use the Permalink option.
I think the fresh baby dill just has a different flavor that isn’t right for pickles and that’s why I don’t recommend it. Those flowering heads on the woody stalks smell unquestionably like my (long-deceased now) Uncle’s old pickle truck in a way the fresh baby fronds don’t. I wish I could describe it better. But the baby fronds are great in chicken soup, Greek dishes and over salmon. The whole heads have this herbaceous punch that just screams “pickles” to me.
And I’ve found no commercial Pickling Spice blend works. All have sweet spices in them that are completely inappropriate for NYC Sour Pickles (note how I never call them Dill Pickles). To me, all they need are the aforementioned Dill, Garlic, Black Peppercorns, Red Chilies, Coriander and Mustard Seed. I detail these in my recipe in the other thread. I don’t use Bay Leaf – again too sweet for my taste. God love Penzey’s, but they’re Goys.
Permalink | Reply
By acgold7 on Sep 2, 2011 01:18 PM
2 Likes
on Sep 3, 2011 08:46 AM
- re: Herne
The reason for the plastic deli containers (which you can get at any supermarket deli counter) is threefold:
- They are cheap (free) and abundant
- The vessels are narrow enough to hold the right amount of pickles together vertically so they resist floating away
- The lids can be pierced to make ventilation holes
Of course, if you have some of those old pickle making vessels like Alton Brown shows on his TV show (the one where the heavy clay lids (which already have air holes cut out) actually fit inside the vessel so they weight down the pickles, those would probably work better than the deli container. I write this assuming that most people would not have access to such specialized equipment (though I’d like to know where you got yours!)
Mr Taster
I googled a bunch of recipes before I made mine (which came out nice and crunchy) and they all mentioning including grape leaves, if you have access to them, to the brine, to keep the crunchiness. The recipe I linked to above mentions using “1 handful fresh grape, cherry, oak, and/or
horseradish leaves (if available)”
Permalink | Reply
By Chris VR on Sep 5, 2011 06:14 AM
According to this website, bay leaves do indeed contain tannic acid, which fully explains my crunchy pickles using neither grape leaves nor oak barrels!
http://earthnotes.tripod.com/bay.htm
Fascinating!
Mr Taster
Permalink | Reply
By Mr Taster on Sep 8, 2011 11
No dill seed that I could find here [France], so my 2Tbsp was mustard seed, coriander, peppercorns (a 5-pepper mix was what I had at home) crushed red pepper flakes (all I could find), dill fronds, and some great big cloves of garlic.
Permalink | Reply
By sunshine842 on Sep 16, 2011 04:12 PM
1 Like
Try this…this is the last archive I can find… a little over 500 responses on the thread, but a TON of info. Right after this was the big restructure that brought us all over here, so it’s the last post that has comments:
2 Likes
Thanks again! That link worked perfectly!
Uh oh! I used “fresh baby dill” from my local Asian market.
I do have grape leaves, but maybe bay leaves serve the same tannin function?
(post deleted by author)
Theres some discussion about the bay keeping it crispy.
Dont worry about the dill…I found my post that I’d used dill fronds because it was all I could find. Also halve the garlic so the flavor infuses better.
It was a monster thread but so much info.
Make note of putting the cukes in an ice bath to hydrate them prior to putting them in the brine…the consensus waa that they stay crispier if they’re fully hydrated.
1 Like
I’ve posted that I now use the 2nd Avenue Deli recipe, but I do remember that Chow article and may give it a try.
Question: I don’t get any scum, even after 4-6 days on the counter, and I’m thinking it’s because of our water quality and having first boiled it. The pickles are really good though. Any thoughts on the possible effect of this?
1 Like
I sometimes do and sometimes don’t, and have not noticed any effect on the pickles. I don’t boil the water, but I do leave it out overnight to “off-gas” it.
1 Like
Probably the reason I make pickles is the simplicity, and control. I love a lot of garlic and red pepper flakes in mine.
I prefer a more nuanced approach, but chacun a son goute!
They be looking good.
1 Like
Here are my Persian cucumber pickles at 7 days. I was out of town.
They are a tad too salty but otherwise perfect! I put in about 5 dried arbol chilies and really like the heat! They will be too soft soon.
2 Likes
Was there a reason you cut them up? Leaving them whole mitigates both saltiness and softness.
1 Like
I cut them in half crosswise (is that a word?) because they wouldn’t fit. I almost abandoned them, in favor of the Kirbys that fit perfectly, but someone said I could cut them, so I tried both.
I plan to try the Kirbys shortly.
