So, European here, going to NYC next month. I know that tipping is common in the USA, but how do New York restaurants deal with Europeans not tipping at all, or a meagre 5%?
To say that it is frowned upon would be an understatement. Some people, who dont go out often or have not kept up for years, might tip 15% and/or might use the ābefore tax & alcoholā base price to determine their tip but, truthfully, no reasonable restaurant goāer is leaving anything less than 20%. If you polled the NYC members of HO, Iād bet that we all give between 20-25% (& have at our group dinners). Thatās why I have guilt leaving āso littleā here, even though I know Iām usually leaving more than expected.
So, āhow do they deal with Europeans not tipping at allā¦.ā? Well, different staff have different personalities, but none that I know deal with it well at all.
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Some restaurants provide a suggested gratuity on their receipts but there really isnāt anything they can do about people who leave none or less then the average 20%. Like SteveR, I normally leave 20-25% unless the service was poor.
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Leave less than 20% at your own peril. In my experience, even the most delightful New York (and sorry, SteveR, I mean Manhattan) waiters can suddenly turn very nasty over tips.
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Gosh, Iām sorry to hear about this kind of treatment from waiters. Shouldnāt happen, no matter what.
But you should also maybe know that the pay scale for waiters is different from other professions in the U.S. which mostly adhere to a basic minimum wage hourly amount (in NYS this is currently $14.20/hour). However, it is assumed that waiters are making their pay in tips, so restaurants are only required to pay around $10/hour assuming they will be making $5/hour in tips. In NYC, this kind of pay is unsupportable to cover living expenses. ($15/hour x 40 hours work = $600/week, about $2500/month). Rents for a couple of bedrooms (family of four) can easily top $2000/month, for example. Childcare allowing both parents to work also needs to be paid at some minimum wageā¦During the pandemic, these restaurants somehow stayed afloat, feeding us in our homes for delivery. These are some of the reasons why we, the eating public in NYC (all the boroughs) do tip as generously as we can for good service.
I think that the pay scale for waiters in Paris (and other parts of Europe) is different. Also a percentage for service is included in the bill. Waiters are compensated as professionals, is my understanding, but still one can imagine not huge sums (at least this is how I imagine it). They also work hard and long hours and mostly get it right. I am happy to add extra to my bill for good service, and be generous about it.
ā(in NYS the [minimum wage] is currently $14.20/hour). However, it is assumed that waiters are making their pay in tips, so restaurants are only required to pay around $10/hour assuming they will be making $5/hour in tips.ā
A different approach in DC. The general minimum is now $16.10 (itās indexed, so a big raise next year), but only $5.35 for tipped workers, BUT, if they donāt get $10.75 an hour in tips, the the employer pays the difference up to $16.10. That rarely happens these day. Thereās currently a referendum to drop the lower hourly and have the $16.10 general. From what little ei her, waiters are divided, concerned that people will stop tipping 20-30% and cut their incomes.
At the risk of ruffling feathers, the sense of entitlement seems to me as a well-traveled Frenchman much more deeply ingrained in the USA than elsewhere. For better or worse, the 20% tip has become a waiterās entitlement irrespective of the level of service.
I should note, confusingly, that some restaurants in the US do include tip in the bill Ć la France, and so there is no need to pay it separately. Most notably and probably longest, this has been at Chez Panisse in Berkeley. I believe it is now the case at Manressa, although I havenāt been there recently to verify. Maybe at Blue Hill?
Where we live (in the States) we are seeing the gradual use of handheld POS (point of sale) devices in restaurants. A recent experience: you tapped the device, and the device gave you, in addition to bill amount, tip options of 15, 18, or 20 percent.
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A number of places in NYC now have them as well & the % varies. Several list 22 or 25% as click options. All have a place to āpersonalizeā your tip & leave the % of your choice.
A # of notable NYC restaurants begain āno tippingā policies several years ago and it looked like it was gaining steam. Instead it seems to have crashed. Several gave it up. One well known restaurant lost quite a few long time waitstaff who went to other places so as to keep getting tips. Lots of variables on this, but its hardly likely that itāll change anytime soon.
Itās an interesting observation, but not one I can wholeheartedly agree with. The concept of tipping based on level of service received is the issue where I believe that we somewhat part ways. Although I do adjust the tip % based on my experience with the waitstaff (much like you round up the bill or leave more for exceptional service), there is a basic 20% that I work from as a minimum, regardless of service. Itās basically the amount that restaurants here in Europe already have included in their bill (āservice comprisā), but U.S. restaurants dont. So, yes, waitstaff do see 15-20% as an āentitlementā &, given the wage regulations and industry standards as they are, I think that this is a realistic expectation in the USA.
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Well, yes, it is an āentitlementā for U.S. waiters, just like salary from the restaurant and servis compris is an āentitlementā for French waiters, non? For the well-traveled Frenchman, perhaps understanding that the culture and system in the US around restaurant salary is very different than in Paris would be good to acknowledge. At the risk of rustling your feathers @ParnParis , it seems like you think the expectation for fair payment is a spoiled (āentitledā in that sense, unless I am mistaking your tone) attitude to have; it seems you think that waiters in the US are not really entitled to be fairly compensated for their work.
Iām with @SteveR, if itās excellent service, I will add to the 20-25%, but these people really do need to live. Iām not sure how it is in Paris, but my understanding is that waiters are treated like the professionals they are and are paid decent salaries from the restaurants. Maybe even the nicer the restaurant, the nicer the salary? Iām not sure how this works, so maybe you can tell us? In New York, anyway, the nicer (read: more expensive) the restaurant, the nicer the tips! (Salary doesnāt change, believe it or not.)
Honestly, I cannot remember a time when I left a restaurant feeling the waiter was upset with me or my tip (except for a recent time in Paris, come to think of it).
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It seems my definition of a āsense of entitlementā is different than yours and yes, you have mistaken my tone. No more need be said.
Not sure I can verbalize this thought but here goes I think that NYC is a peculiar restaurant consumer compared to SF or Paris. The NYers I know consider dinners out an integral part of their week. Late work hours, small kitchens, avoidance of cooking smells, disposable incomes ā letās eat out tonight. Our French and Parisian friends tend to dine out for occasions, make a simple soup on weeknights.
So, especially after covidās devastation on the restaurant industry, NYers feel a special bond with and guardianship responsibility for the restaurants that are extensions of their living rooms.
Hopefully, SteveR can clean up this rough thought.
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NY is behind the curve. In SF, Iāve seen as high as 30%. To be honest, this whole thing really pisses me off. Add on almost 10% sales tax and 6% (I think thatās it) restaurant health care fee and youāre talking almost 50% increase over the listed prices (which are already quite high in SF). Itās why we almost never go out to eat in SF any more, nor do most of our friends.
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Your thoughts are never āroughā and, in fact, youāve captured the situation pretty well, especially if one narrows it down to the sub-set of the NYC population that posts on the restaurant food boards (thereās an entirely different sub-set on the cooking boards, with only some minimal overlap, & they may not fit your description). Iām not sure if thereās a commensurate group of restaurant going SF people who post on HO & could weigh in here (maybe if this tangential discussion was moved to another part of the HO board they would see it?) but, knowing several of you who live in SF & post on the Paris board, I know that you have a different lifestyle when home (whereas I really dont). That leads to different perspectives on how we experience Paris when here. Add to that the very different restaurant culture that Parn and Ptipois (okay, Iāll get around to using your new ānameā soon) live with here (& the fact that theyāre willing to participate so fully in an English speaking board) and sometimes our exchanges are more due to us trying to compare apples vs oranges vs grapes than anything else. In my experience, this comes out in tipping discussions more than just about any other topic.
Just to add to onziemeās agita (& Iāll try not to bring it up during our lunch today), there is now an expectation of 20% tip on food delivery & a tip jar on just about every merchantās counter in NYC. Apparently, the war between employers paying workers what should be their entire salary vs. making the consumer pay the employee directly, is reaching a ātipping pointā (Iām allowed one pun/post). Another battle for the next generation to fight. Iām too tired.
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Apologies, @ParnParis, hard to tell tone sometimes on hereā¦not sure what you meant then by ruffling feathers! Donāt know why then Manhattan waiters would turn ānasty,ā if you are understanding that they are entitled to a 15-20% tip and leave itā¦what causes the ānastyā do you think?
The recently published book, āA Waiter in Parisā by Edward Chisholm makes it sound like there are rodents crawling along the walls in Paris restaurants. Iāve never encountered any or heard anyone mention anything along those lines. And he claims waiters in Paris expect and need tips. I wasnāt crazy about the book, BTW.
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Well, only two details from that book and both are BSā¦
Rats are particularly flourishing these days in Paris (try to sit down on the grass in the Jardins du TrocadĆ©ro if you dare), but I am yet to see one crawling along a wall in a Paris restaurant. Even a cute little mouse. There are rodents in underground cellars, and some very old buildings in Paris can have two or three levels of them. Some restaurants sit above such multistoried cellars. But the critters donāt usually leave them unless someone wants to play a joke on you (that happened to me once at El Fogon).
As for tipping, some waiters expect tips from American customers because Americans tip. Simple as that. They donāt expect them from French customers aside from a simple rounding-up.
