I’ve read that some induction cooktops can automatically regulate oil temperature in a deep-frying vessel. Does your induction cooktop have this feature, or have you seen cooktops with such a feature?
Huh?
A combination doesn’t seem unreasonable. I think high end products allow for mixed technologies.
Affordable is the key word.
Hi bmorecupcake,
Mine won’t do that, but check out the “control freak” I linked to above.
Ray
I’m a little confused. There are certainly duel-fuel cookers with gas cooktops and electric ovens. That makes sense as oven temperature control is easier for the manufacturer and therefore better for us.
Are you looking for both gas and induction burners? Why? If you have gas available why spend more for induction burners? For much less money you can get all the fine control of induction including at low temperatures from gas.
There are major differences in how induction and gas can be used to cook. There can be many more subtle scaled gradations of energy possible with induction: my Vollrath Pro has 100; gas about 10. With induction, one can cook with both “energy” and “temperature” modes: with gas, only “energy.” With induction, one can adjust induction energy levels based on temperature within the pan or pot–using an external sensor. Not possible with gas.
Cooking is different with induction. Better or worse is really up to the user.
Ray
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Well, I have to have electric where I live. After 18 years of a glass top electric, induction is a life changer! I can actually bring something to a boil and reduce it to a simmer! You have no idea how great that is until you can’t do it!
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Not my experience at all. On the gas cooktops I use the valve is continuous. The numbers are just a reference. There are an infinite number of choices/settings with gas.
dave
Gas stoves have a narrow dynamic range. As the dial is turned lower and lower, gas stoves will just turn off because a minimal gas pressure/flow is needed. Below which it will shut off or worse the fire will migrate inside.
If a gas stove has a max output at 12000 BTU/hr, it will be difficult that it can go down below 2400 BTU/hr without turning off the flame – which means usually less than 5 fold range, at best 10 fold. Consequently, the more powerful a gas stove is, the more difficult it can be used for simmer. This is why people buy flame tamer or heat diffuser for gas stove.
For a restaurant powerful gas stove (~180,000 BTU/hr), there is no low flame.
As mention, a ~5 fold dynamic range (sometime less) is what is usually expected for a gas stove. Their lowest settings are pretty much the highest setting for a resident gas stove.
Electric stoves (induction or coil) have a higher dynamic range.
Don’t think I’ve ever come across kitchen equipment designed to be operated by knees before. Full-contact cooking!
Dynamic range is a different issue than gradations. You are correct that keeping a flame going at very low levels is an issue. That’s why, since at least 1995 you can buy cook tops with controllers that turn the burner on and off. I had a Thermador unit that had two such burners. I could melt chocolate over those burners without a double boiler. It’s exactly the same cycling concept that induction hobs use - turn the power on and off. Easy peasey.
Great observation! It is actually quiet popular. Once you get heck of it, it can be faster and more sanitize (the hand never touch the nob), and possibly safer too.
Here is a video, if you look at 1:04 min, he turned off the stove without his hand, and then he continuously turning on and off. I have seen a few videos like this. You can control your cookware with your hands, and your gas stove with your legs – probably more important for wok cooking since the wok manipulation is quiet often.
There is also design to turn on and off water without the hands too.
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Dave,
It’s not a matter of experience–there are clearly things one can do with induction that are impossible with gas. Even if one could deliver differences of less than 2 degrees Fahrenheit with a continuous gas valve, I doubt that one could reproduce that temperature or turn an energy setting into a temperature setting. Gas doesn’t have a temperature mode; one can’t point to a setting on a gas dial and k now what temperature it is.
Gas and induction are different in meaningful ways that can matter.
Ray
Dave,
The firmware and software control on induction is far more complex than on and off. With a sensor in the pan and a sensor on the floor of the pan, one can modulate both up and down power and frequency. Not so “easy peasy” with gas controls that have no controlling sensors and need to interpolate energy flow both between sensors and increase or decrease of power.
Ray
Yikes. I just posted a four paragraph re-framing of my original question. And then I came to my senses.
Hi jammie,
Made me laugh.
Read your now nonexistant post. Induction gives an instant response, and can actually “tune” a simmer with magnetic pots and pans. Won’t work with copper or aluminum bases.
Ray
I wasn’t going to say anything, but I also read the post right before jammie withdrew it, I think. And I kind of snorted at the mention of departed cookware techies…not in a mean way of course.
Ray,
You made too posts that are relevant - I’m responding to both here.
There are two separate things going on here. Conflating them doesn’t help. Let’s break them apart.
First is control - the ability to make more or less heat. A standard gas valve has an infinite number of gradations. If you remote control it (see below) you’ll almost certainly use a stepper motor which does present some gradations, but no more than in the usual optical system on an induction controller.
Second is control feedback. This goes to your point about “temperature” v. “energy.” I agree that to my knowledge there isn’t anything currently on the market. It isn’t hard from an engineering point of view. Although the parameters are different (mostly start-up time and dwell time) the electronic controls on a Thermador gas valve can use the same pulse width modulation (PWM) approach that induction burners use. Ultimately it IS on and off and it IS easy peasy.
It’s just a matter of the manufacturers of gas appliances to decide there is a market.
So lets get practical. An experienced cook will know where to set the gas to heat and hold a dish. It really isn’t hard. Sure - you can’t wander off to watch “House of Cards” (solution: iPad in the kitchen). Sure you need decent thermometers. I like the Taylor dials ($8) but you can get cool little Bluetooth ones that connect to apps on your phone for way under $50.
Induction is not better than gas. Portable induction brings safety and capacity issues with circuits and plugs. Induction is better than resistive.
I actually had an electric oven before. I bake a lot, and surprisingly my gas oven has been very good at maintaining temperature. And I like my gas broiler way more than the electric broiler I had before.
There were two reasons I wanted my range to have both gas and induction burners. I like my high BTU gas burner for wok cooking, but even the lowest BTU burner on my range can give me problems holding a simmer. Also, I admit, I wanted to boil water faster.
Dave: First is control - the ability to make more or less heat. A standard gas valve has an infinite number of gradations. If you remote control it (see below) you’ll almost certainly use a stepper motor which does present some gradations, but no more than in the usual optical system on an induction controller.
Ray: It’s more complex than that. The continuous valve is analog, and needs an analog to digital transformation for scaling to be possible. Then, the increases in temperature with changes in valve opening are non linear, so the function needs to have nonlinear scaled to make it as linear as possible. I don’t think that could be done with gas in any straightforward way.
Dave: I agree that to my knowledge there isn’t anything currently on the market. It isn’t hard from an engineering point of view.
Ray: How does one record temperature at the bottom of the pan in any meaningful way with gas? Answer that one and you’ve got a patent or two—or three.
Now, explain how one would simultaneously connect the valve to readings from both the inside of the pan–and the floor.
How would you interpolate?
Now tell me where one would place the temperature dials separate from energy on the stovetop.
Finally, explain how you would systematically change from temperature to temperature in a multi-step process–and remember the next time?
Dave:
An experienced cook will know where to set the gas to heat and hold a dish. It really isn’t hard.
Ray:
An induction user can tune a simmer, remember it, and have it as a preset the next time around.
And it’s much safer when not carefully attended: it switches itself off before things get out of control.
Ugh, are you trying to explain. . Never mind.
I referred to copper lines that are made for induction. De Buyer makes a line. Also I think Matfer Bourgeat but I haven’t googled in a while. I believe they have a steel disc in the bottom. Unsure. I would like someone out there who has used this stuff (on induction of course) to tell me how it stacks up compared to traditional copperware on gas.
I don’t think you’re that dude so don’t sweat it.
