Montreal food and gifts: what to buy, where to buy it

Regional Dining Discussions Quebec, Maritimes, Prairies
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No. I thought about taking cooking courses when I was younger but decided to go in management instead. My father used to work as a cook on Canadian Pacific trains in the 50’s (60’s?) to pay for his medical school. He became a doctor.

We are all great cooks in my family so the apple did not fall far from the tree. I’m a recruiter by trade so looking for difficult things to find is second nature for me I guess. My mother once looked at me wistfully after tasting a dessert I made and told me “maybe we should have let you go to cooking school after all”. What’s weird is I remember that being an option but I never remembered being adamant about it.

I have no illusion about it though. There is a big difference between having food as a hobby and food as a job. If I would have taken another path, I might not be having as much fun with food right now.

I do wonder about possibly opening a bar though. A small bar with a small cocktail list and rotating micro selection. Something like “Smokeless joe” in Toronto. Its still a pipe dream though. If I ever have a spare 50-100 000$ I might take the plunge… :stuck_out_tongue:

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Thanks for a wonderful list! You have single handedly make visitors to your fine city bring home much more food-related items than they are capable of carrying…

I have seen wild blueberries from Quebec sold. Any idea whether these are grown or wild?

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Thanks!

The chocolaterie des père trappistes says they go through 1232.5 pounds of blueberries a day to produce 5500 boxes so they most assuredly are farmed. They seem to be smaller than your typical commercial blueberries. Smaller and tastier:

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If you want wild blueberries, I’d try to look at the bleuet sauvage boutique at marché jean-talon from mid July to mid September although a lot of fruit merchants will carry blueberries in season.

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Maple syrup

Maple syrup is boiled and diluted maple sap. Maple syrup is boiled down maple sap and was historically used as a sugar substitute in its sugar form because cane sugar was more expensive. During the 20th century, maple syrup increased in value so maple sugar in recipes was substituted to the cheaper brown sugar. That’s why you see a lot of traditional Quebec recipes (like tarte aux sucres, sugar pie) list “maple syrup or brown sugar” as ingredients nowadays. Click on the following link for an english version of a typical “sugar pie” recipe: http://captmtl.tumblr.com/post/92568956806/tarte-au-sucre-sugar-pie-ingredients-4-cups

Maple syrup season will start at the first thaw in spring. The thawing/freezing process of spring will cause the sap to go up and down the maple tree, enabling its capture through taps. The colour of the resulting syrup will evolve during the season, starting very light early and becoming increasingly darker and vegetal in taste as the season goes on. These will need to be bought in special shops and producers because the syrup we have access in supermarkets are of pretty standard quality.

Dark late season syrup vs pale early season syrup. Their taste vary widely:

Maple was historically produced in “Cabane à sucres” (maple shack). The sap was gathered manually and the shack would throw a big feast to thank workers. That feast became a basis for a tradition called “sugar shaking”. Each year, around march and as long as the season permits, sugar shacks all over the provinces open their doors to tourists and quebecquers alike to throw a big feast of traditional Quebec food.

Traditional Sugar Shack

A celebrated Montreal chef, the famous “Martin Picard” recently bought his own sugar shack and started experimenting with the product, presenting his latest creation each season. He puts tickets on sale at the start of each year and the whole season gets sold in less than a day. You have to be incredibly fast and lucky to snag tickets.

Martin Picard sugar shack:

He has a book! Its very different from traditional cooking books and was self published without compromise:

Marina O’Loughlin, english restaurant critic, visited Martin Picard’s sugar shack and wrote an interesting article on it:

For those who speak french, you are in luck, there is a TV show that cover his adventures each season. It is fascinating to watch:
http://unchefalacabane.telequebec.tv/

Quebec sells 68 percent of the world’s maple syrup. The rest of the production is assured by Vermont, Maybe and New York state.

It is transformed in a number of products:

Maple syrup
The product itself. Available at all supermarkets in Quebec. The “traditional” can is this one:

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Maple sugar
Maple sugar can still be found but it is expensive, making the use of maple syrup or brown sugar more prevalent:

Maple butter
Maple butter is used as a spread on toast, a bit like nutella or caramel. It separates with time to you have to stir it before using it. Be carefull: there are two qualities to it: maple butter (the best one) and maple composed butter (more industrial)

Maple Butter looks like this:

Composed butter looks like this:

In my experience the more widely found butter is composed butter. It is way less expensive.

Maple liqueur
Maple flavoured whiskey (see: http://domainepinnacle.com/produits/coureur-des-bois-whisky-a-lerable/ and http://www.saq.com/page/fr/saqcom/liqueur/sortilege/522482 ) and Maple flavoured bailey(see http://domainepinnacle.com/produits/creme-derable-coureur-des-bois/ and http://www.saq.com/page/fr/saqcom/creme/sortilege-creme-derable/12139456 ) can be found at most provincial liquor stores (SAQ)

Maple taffy
Maple taffy is boiled maple syrup quickly cooled down on fresh snow. It cannot be bought and is a unique experience only available at sugar shacks.

Maple leaf cookies
Maple leaf cookies are widely known in Quebec and are available at most supermarket.
https://az692377.vo.msecnd.net/media/image/product/fr/medium/0005635862019.jpg

Maple syrup candies
We don’t eat those a lot. Its mostly sold to tourists:

Maple fudge
This product is mostly sold to tourists also. The fudge we eat is made with brown sugar and is called sucre à la crème or “Cream sugar” (see for recipe: http://captmtl.tumblr.com/post/92568427981/sucre-à-la-crème-creamed-sugar-or-sugar )

Where to find it

Most things we buy regularly can be found at most supermarkets (maple syrup, maple sugar, maple butter, maple leaf cookies). These will be the less expensive maple things you can buy:

Tourist stores will carry higher prices items and more touristic things (lollypop, fudges, fancy maple syrup bottles and butters):

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Specialised maple products can also be found at the Atwater market and Jean-Talon Market.

There is a specialised maple syrup store in the old Montreal:

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A more detailed look at Martin Picard’s Pied de cochon sugar shack, from Andrew Zimmern’s Bizarre food. Bourdain went too but it doesn’t seem to be available on youtube.

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Cheese

History

I hear you from here: “Its normal that Quebec has such a good selection of cheese given their french heritage!”

Not quite.

Our french heritage has little to do with our modern french offerings. It will help bring in french speaking european in the 1980’s, 90’s and later to give us their influence but had little to do with shaping our historic landscape where it comes to cheese.

From what I understand, cheese consumption under french rule was segmented by social status. Those with enough money would import cheese from europe while the rest would produce their own simple cheese , called a “Paillasson” (a mat in english). Farmers with a milk surplus would make their cheese on a reed mat, thus the name. Paillasson production would disappear with time, apparently ending in the 1970’s but a recent entrepreneur has brought the recipe back recently. It is a very young artisanal cheese with few complexities:

see http://www.fromagesdeliledorleans.com/

Quebec’s first big love affair with cheese wasn’t with french cheese. It was with english cheddar. The first boom came in the 1890’s with the foundation of the Perron cheese factory. Perron cheddar is still available in most supermarket and is the oldest quebec cheesemaker still in operation. It would eventually become the official provider of cheddar to the british crown for almost a century. The manager of this cheese factory is still in the family and the original factory was transformed in the museum of cheddar in the 90’s.

see http://www.fromagerieperron.com/eng/accueil.shtm
http://www.ourcheeses.com/directory/cheddar-perron/

Quebec even started their own dairy school in 1892 in saint-hyacinthe (the school closed by the city is still home with one of the biggest agrocultural school in quebec). Cheddar was such a big thing that Canada provinded up to 60% of England’s cheddar consumption in 1897.

The monastery in Oka would produce their eponymous cheese starting in 1893. It is a semi-soft washed rind cheese that can still be found in most supermarkets in Quebec. The trappist monk sold the license in 1996 to commercial cheese giant Agropur but it is still the same cheese made with the same method. The Oka, with Perron, is one of Quebec’s earliest cheese and was apparently influenced by a breton cheese called Port Salut.

The next oldest Quebec cheese still available is l’Ermite from Fromagerie de Saint-Benoit du Lac. Produced since 1943, this blue cheese is still made by the benedictine monks and available in most supermarkets.

Quebec has tried to produce Camembert and Feta in 1910 but it didn’t stick because the demand wasn’t there.

Here, cheddar was king. The production was so large in some years that cheddar producers had to take their excess production, cut it up in chunks and salt it to be sold in small plastic bags for individual consumption. That product became known as “cheese curds” and was very popular, being sold in greasy spoons and corner stores all over Quebec.

Of course, one of those greasy spoons had a client who wanted to mix these curds with fries and sauce and thus was born our dish known as “poutine”.

I don’t think anybody knows where cheese curds originated. Poutine has been known to originate from Le Roy Jucep in Drummondville (see http://www.jucep.com/accueil ) so that might be Fromagerie Lemaire in the same city ( http://www.fromagerie-lemaire.ca/index.html ). Victoriaville also has a claim on the origin of poutine so Fromagerie Victoria might be it (see: http://fromagerievictoria.com/index.php ). Maybe it was Fromagerie Saint-Laurent that dates from 1930? (see http://fromageriest-laurent.com/ ). I haven’t been able to find out either!

Want to find fresh cheese curds in Quebec? Just look for cheddar producers! Most of them will sell their excess (or “make” excess cheddar, as cheese curds as so popular nows) in bulk at the factory.

I don’t know of any factory in Montreal though. You’ll have to take your car and visit the regions outside the big city to get at the source. Here are some producers of fresh cheese curds I know of:

And I’m stopping here because there are too many. Quebec has a ton of cheese producers! Just make a search when you are visiting a region and you are bound to find one. The only thing is that they are near cows and there are no cows on the island of Montreal. :stuck_out_tongue:

Few knows about it outside quebec but the humble cheese curd has a cousin named “Tortillon” or “Twist”. It is the same cheddar base as cheese curds but it is brined a lot more so its way saltier. It is less known because there are no iconic dishes made with it but you can still find “Tortillon” near cheese curds at cornerstores and supermarkets all over the country. It was probably developed at the same time as cheese curds, so around 1950-1960.

See: http://www.kingsey.com/tortillon_en.html

When I was young, in the 1980’s, the american mozarella (the solid brick few italians would recognise as such), cheddar, pamesan in a box (remember this? https://i.ytimg.com/vi/KLtq_bRFImE/hqdefault.jpg) and the swiss knight fondue brick was king (see http://demandware.edgesuite.net/aabg_prd/on/demandware.static/-/Sites-CATALOG_Zabars/default/dw034dd3b2/images/max_5GE1003.jpg ). “Fancy french” cheese were Camembert and Brie. Cheese culture was still pretty basic and similar to what was found in the rest of north america.

Little did we know that the second “golden age” of Quebec cheese was under preparation.

Our modern trend of artisanal cheese is tied to the arrival of Fritz Kaiser, a canadian of swiss descent and master cheesemaker who began crafting his cheese in 1981 (see http://www.kaisercheese.com/ ) . He began with adapting a swiss classic, “raclette cheese”, a swiss traditional cheese designed to melt. His most famous cheese is probably “Le Douanier” (see: http://www.ourcheeses.com/directory/le-douanier/ )

With time and effort, with the help of tv and press, the local Quebec artisanal cheese scene became bigger and bigger. The 90’s saw a great leap forward in the availability and consumption of local Quebec artisanal cheese.

The 2000’s saw most special occasions among friends and family featuring a cheese course with local discoveries. The tradition is so anchored in my family that they think they always did it even though I remember it is a fairly new thing.

This tradition had its challenges, however. Cheese producers had to fight against a Canadian government law that wanted to ban raw milk cheese production in 1996… with success. Quebec cheese production represent roughly 60% of Canada’s volume but recently negociated a free trade agreement with Europe opening a larger door to european cheese to the Canadian market. Quebec cheese does not benefit from the same subsidies that European producers benefit so they are often more expensive. The trade agreement is still being ratified and some artisanal cheese producers say they probably won’t survive the onslaught of cheap european cheese.

Quebec has a quota system to regulate milk prices and the price for milk in Canada is more expensive than in the USA or France. Even with their own cows, producers of milk has to “sell virtually” its milk to the milk producers federation and “buy it back” at market prices. The laws of Quebec surrounding cheese production is also way stricter than in France so that occurs additional costs. Some producers had problems developing and experimenting with their own herds of cow since everything had to be regimented with the same rules as milk producers. The inspectors from the province of Quebec (the MAPAQ) are ruthless and target the local producers fiercely.

The first shock an immigrant from France experience in Quebec is the price of cheese and wine. Cheese in France is cheap and prevalent (being subsidised by the government helps). The cost of the same product in Quebec is way higher. Locally produced cheese don’t even have the advantage of price… without the same support of the government, the additional cost of milk and the administrative cost of having everything in stainless steel (as opposed to, say, a rocky basement deep in a French province), Quebec produced cheese are usually more expensive than their French variants.

That doesn’t stop Quebec residents from asking for Quebec products by name when making their purchase decision. That demand, still strong after all the waves the producers had to submit themselves to, is the basis of our local productions. Quebecquers are proud of their cheese and support their industry. They are greatly paid back by having access to a varied selection.

Artisanal cheesemaking in Quebec is a new frontier. The government might be doing its level best to annoy or bancrupt producers but the market is wide open to new discoveries. French artisans are often hidebound by tradition and often feel caught by chains of their own making. The same artisans will often mention that the Quebec scene is a breath of fresh air were numerous influences mix and meld without constraint. You are from a French school of production and you want to include elements from swiss and english traditions? No problem! Go right ahead! If the result is good we’ll buy it!

What to buy

There are a number of website featuring Quebec cheese. My favorite is fromage du quebec which focus the artisanal producers ( http://fromagesduquebec.qc.ca/en/home/ ) but this one has a larger selection from industrial origins: ( http://www.ourcheeses.com/ ).

The best way to discover new cheeses is to follow the Caseus prize rewarding the best cheeses in Quebec each year. The Caseus selection has been founded in 1999 and gives numerous prizes. For our domestic market the caseus nomination probably gives our local cheese the best visibility.

Here is a short list of all the cheeses that won either special mentions or gold, silver and bronze medals since the foundation of the prize (see http://www.caseus.ca/documents/Caseus1999_2014.pdf for the whole list). It looks like a long list but it is only a short sample! I indicated some cheeses which switched names and did not list those who disappeared from the market. When available I will include a review from a website I enjoy reading (its a blog)

Where to find it?

As you might guess, there are a number of cheese shops in Montreal!

Here are a few I like:

  • Supermarkets : our supermarkets (IGA, Metro, Loblaws) seem to have a larger selection of Quebec products each year. Don’t forget them! You might not find speciality products but don’t hesitate to go and see if you are near one, you might be surprised!
  • Fromagerie Atwater : Gilles Jourdenais from Fromagerie Atwater is one of the few cheesemongers described as a “cheese somelier”. Fromagerie Atwater is located in the Atwater market and is considered as one of the more expensive but people there know their stuff. http://www.fromagerieatwater.ca/
  • Fromagerie Hamel: Also known as “the other fromagerie at the Marché Atwater”, Hamel is also located at Marché Jean-Talon and a bit everywhere in Montreal. They have a very nice selection. http://www.fromageriehamel.com/boutiques/
  • Fromagerie Copette The little cheesemonger that could! Located outside the markets in Verdun and less expensive to boot they offer friendly service and are my favorite underdog cheese shop. http://www.fromageriecopette.com/
  • Le marché des saveurs I almost never go to Marché Jean-Talon so I cannot speak much about this institution. I do know it by reputation and expect them to have a nice selection. http://www.lemarchedessaveurs.com/fr/index.php
  • Qui lait cru Another cheesemonger at the Marché Jean-Talon. I know little about it. https://www.facebook.com/quilaitcru
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Bagel

Everybody knows bagels are synonymous with New-York city. What might be less known is that Montreal developed its own parallel bagel tradition that evolved over the years. Today, they make two different products with distinct characteristics (a similar thing happened with smoked meat and pastrami).

Montreal bagels are smaller, thinner and sweeter than New York bagels. They are always baked in a wood oven, contain malt and egg but no salt and are boiled in honey water before baking.

Bagel are known to have polish origins but the earliest known Montreal bagel producers were east european jews probably fleeing from Russian pogroms in the late 19th and early 20th century. Isadore Schlafman and Cheim Seligman have been known to sell bagels in the early half of the 20th century in Montreal.

Isadore would go ahead and open a bagel bakery in 1919, which moved in 1949 and adopt the name “Fairmount Bagel”. The place is still open and they bake and sell their product in the same traditional way every day.

Chein Seligman would open his bagel bakery in 1957 with a jewish immigrant who fled europe following the second world war: Myer Lewkowicz. The bakery became known as St-Viateur Bagel and is located a few street away from Fairmounth Bagel. They are to this day the oldest competitors on the island.

Every Montrealer will have their preference. I prefer Saint-Viateur but honestly? Its a matter of personal choice, just like those who want to know if New York or Montreal style is better. There is no best bagel, only individual opinions. Its like coke vs pepsi.

Where to buy it: St.Viateur and Fairmount are open 24/24, 7 days a week. The best way to sample them is fresh from their wood oven, directly at the store. Their store is located near the trendy Plateau Mont-Royal neighbourhood (in Mile-End) which is fairly centrally located so you have no reason not to go!

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An interesting side note is that these tarts are also quite popular in Cantonese bakeries and some times dimsum joints here in North America because the Portuguese brought the tarts with them to Macau.

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Smoked meat

Two jewish disapora escaping from east europe at the same time. One lands in Montreal and develop a dry cured, soaked and smoked beef brisket that would be called smoked meat. The other would land and New York and come up with a similar product that’s dried cured and smoked but not soaked called Pastrami. Like Montreal and New York bagels, both probably came from similar origin but evolved differently because they didn’t come from the same exact recipes and served a different customer base

Smoked Meat

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Pastrami Sandwich

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Where to buy it

Schwartz
Manhattan has Katz, Montreal has Schwartz. Established in 1928, this famed jewish deli has long been the reference for smoked meat in Montreal. Everyday, rain or shine, lines of tourists will be found to sample the rough service (its as if they prided themselves on being rough and expeditive) and the classic smoked meat / black cherry soda combo (the Cott brand is preferred here). The name is so iconic that it was bought by the famed René Angelil and Céline Dion duo in 2012. Although they promised not to change anything, a number of enthousiasts have found the smoked meat there to be uneven. It is not considered to be “the best smoked meat in Montreal” anymore but it might just be the most accessible (you have to have to car to get to “the best smoked meat” as it is not located downtown)

Main’s
Main Deli Steak House (or Main’s for the natives) was founded in 1974 by Peter Varvaro. Located just in front of Schwartz, it quickly became a home for those unsatisfied with Schwartz’s rough service, long lines and uncomfortable dining area. Let tourists go to Schwartz, you’d hear residents of Plateau Mont-Royal say, we have Main’s and the smoked meat there is every bit as good as the one in front. Celine Dion might have bought Schwatz but when she wanted a smoked meat in Montreal, she used to go to Main’s. Unfortunately, Peter Varvaro died in 2013 and the iconic restaurant subsequently bought and “modernized” by its new owners. Reports of Schwartz’s unevenness should have worked in Main’s favor. The overhaul of the smoked meat recipe, however, insured that it can’t be counted as a competitor to Schwartz anymore. I know at least one regular who told be he could not recognise anything from the main last time he went there… especially not the smoked meat. It stays an important institution in Montreal, if only for memory’s sake. All is not lost though. Peter’s sons, Peter Varvaro Jr and Philip Varvaro continue their father’s tradition in their own restaurant: L’ile Perrot’s Smoked Meat Pete and Dorval’s Delibees.

Here is a small documentary on Peter Varvaro Sr and the Mains that should interest the curious and enthousiasts

Quebec Smoked Meat
Ok, I hear you. You are downtown and you don’t want to go trekking to what amount to be suburbs by car(sorry Dorval, if I can’t get to you by metro you get classified as suburbia by me). Schwartz is not what it used to and Main is a zombie. What to do? You go to Quebec Smoked Meat. Be advised: the place is not a restaurant. Its an Ukrainian butcher shop. They produce smoke meat, among other things, to sell to restaurants in the Montreal area. Its my favorite smoked meat in downtown Montreal however. The sandwiches are cheap and they can sell you vacuum packed smoked meat by weight if you want to bring some back home.

Smoked Meat Pete
Want to know what is my favorite smoked meat in Montreal? Look no further than smoked meat pete. The restaurant, which looks like a hybrid between a blues bar and a southern BBQ shack, is owned by Peter Varvaros Jr, son of legendary Main founder Peter Varvaros Sr. Main’s might not be the same but the quality seem to have followed Vavaros Sr’s sons. The place is spacious, the smoked meat is great, the fries are out of this world but its roughly a 50 minutes car ride from downtown Montreal. If you are from Toronto, however, its on your way back!

Delibees
Turns up that Peter Varvaro Sr had another son, Philip Varvaro. Philip would go on and found his own restaurant called Delibees in Dorval. Its much closer to downtown Montreal but I’ve never been there so I can’t speak on the quality. Sources say its on the same level as Smoked Meat Pete and might even be better! Its on my list to visit for sure.

Other options
Lester’s Deli in Outremont isn’t that bad. I’m told that Dunn’s is ok but that it is expensive and re-steamed from packaged wrap. Don’t go to reuben’s. Don’t buy smoked meat from supermarket (even if its packaged with Schwart’s name)

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Yes!

I’ve heard of a tourist that told us he prefered the Natas in Macau. Never been there so I can’t compare. He seemed a bit precious thought so I take his opinion with a grain of salt.

A portuguese friend told me the best are found in Belem (the patron saint city of Pateis de Nata in Portugal). Unlike the precious tourist I do trust her!

Tried to make homemade Natas. The caramelisation is a bitch to get right (they work with pizza style wood oven in Belem so you have to crank up your oven to the maximum and pray to try to get a similar result). Scorched the flaked pastry in my attempt to caramelize the custard. I haven’t finished my experiments but variants include freezing the flaked pastry in the mold (or putting it in a fridge), putting an ambient temperature custard in the cold mold and putting everything in a 550 oven in hopes that everything bakes evenly. Truly a fascinating challenge.

My original recipe:

First try result (tried a home made flaked pastry… will buy it next time… its not fun to make):

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Coffee

First wave, second wave, third wave? What’s that?

You’ll see a lot of coffee lovers say they prefer “third wave” coffee. Other think the whole “third wave” culture is a hipster phenomenon full of hot air. Regardless of your position, I believe it can be interesting to know where that whole concept come from and how it applies to Montreal.

The first wave is the prototypical “good ol’ cup of joe” at your average diner and is probably best represented by our Tim Hortons and Dunkin Donuts. At best you’ll be asked if you like your coffee “bold” or “mild”

Tim Horton and Dunkin Donuts used to be equally popular in the 80’s but, while Tim Horton expended and kept their restaurants in a great state of repair, Dunkin Donuts never put any money back in their franchises so their brand died down and perished over the years. Tim Horton is now an iconic Canadian brand and you would be hard pressed finding a Dunkin in Montreal.

The second wave came in with Starbucks in the states and Second Cup in Canada with Montréal having some local variants like Aux Deux Maries and La Brulerie St-Denis. You’ll usually have two information in hand when you order your coffee: the blend [usually the provenance of the bean but it could be a mix] and the roast [brown to black]. I learned most of what I know about coffee at Brulerie Saint-Denis when I was a young student because they used to change the “coffee of the day” every day so I would take note on the “wow moments”. Plus they let you work without asking you to leave and the waitresses were very, very cute. For the record my favourite coffee is a very fruity very acid coffee with lots of lenght made with south american beans lightly roasted (on the brown side)

Third wave coffee appeared 5-10 years ago and is focused on european variants, optimal preparations techniques, specific blending and alternative “drip” methods (you’ll see your drip coffee replace by a “Chemex” preparation for example), If second wave roasters were the coffee answer to sommeliers, the third wave specialist are a hipster version of mixologists.

You have to know that we have a well established french and italian diaspora so “espresso’s” were a thing even before the third wave came in. Italian espressos are a bit different though. I find them more earthy with less fruityness and acidity. Overall I tend to like them less.

3rd wave coffee will probably produce your best cappucino. I am a drip coffee drinker but when I want a great espresso I go to these places (and then I regret not taking another double espresso and I have to contain myself because I know drinking espressos at the rate I would enjoy would lead to a very pleasant but very early death.)

I’m not a fan of chemex. Even if I have a very high tolerance to caffeine (I can drink up to 60 oz of drip coffee in a day, I can drink a pot of coffee and go to sleep 10 mins after) I find chemex a bit too intense. I once had a working session in café saint-henri after which I had a coffee buzz after taking two espressos and a chemex. I had to stop walking because my heart was going too fast. Not a fun experience.

Where to find them?

First and second generation coffee shops are easy to find. Just throw a rock and you’re liable to hit one.

Tim Hortons (first generation) are everywhere with Starbucks and Second Cups (second generation) close behind. My sentimental favourites of the second generation are Brulerie Saint-Denis on Rue Saint-Denis (see http://www.yelp.ca/biz/brûlerie-st-denis-montréal-20 ) and Aux Deux Marie on the same road ( http://www.yelp.ca/biz/aux-deux-marie-montréal-3 ). None are spectacular per se but I learned which coffee I prefered at those places so they still have a special veneer.

We also have a lot of third generation coffee shops:

Do you have a map for coffee places in Montreal?

Yes, and its pretty insane! Its pretty up to date to boot!
http://gazdata-assets.s3.amazonaws.com/coffee-toggle.html

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My favourite is Caffé San Simeon nella Piccola Italia, near my place. Not expensive or trendy. I do like their coffee.

As well as longstanding Italian, French and also Portuguese cafés (some from the Mediterranean were definitely for the boys), there was also an important wave of Central European cafés, mostly Hungarian, some Czech, after the defeat of the Hungarian Revolution of 1956. They had very good coffee, all were welcome - the Hungarian diaspora was not large enough to make up an exclusive clientele - and of course had the most marvellous cakes and pastries.

Almost all of these places have disappeared in Montréal and in Toronto, as the younger generations (the children of refugees who were often educated and déclassé over here) went on to professional jobs with less demanding work schedules.

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We certainly ate a wider range of cheeses than you describe in the 1970s and 1980s, but I lived first on the Plateau near St-Laurent and its cheese shops that weren’t terribly expensive, then northeastern Plateau near Papineau (there were a couple of good cheesemongers, but often I walked up the the Italian groceries north of the railway tracks that separated the Plateau and la Petite-Patrie). The closest was Italo at the corner of Papineau and Beaubien. I walked in last summer, after buying natas at Bela Vista a bit farther south, and it was a sad shadow of its former self.

Nowadays, in terms of supermarkets, the small PA and Adonis chains have better value than the big ones you mention, as do Intermarché and Euro Marché. The closest PA to your neighbourhood would be rue du Fort, if you happen to be going up the hill. No far from the closest Adonis, though I don’t know how extensive their selection is.

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Souperman, we had a friend in Massena - he was transferred there, working at a car plant - that or take early (and poverty) retirement - and he came here as often as he could. He found the food offering better even in Cornwall across the river than in Massena…

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Too bad I didn’t sample the Belem version when I was there years ago. I looked up some recipes for natas and they seem to be using temperatures in the range of 400F/200C. Could that be the problem?

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400 didnt caramelize for me. Had to finish it at broil. Second try at 550 was better but had trouble with the dough.

Freezing or chilling the dought might fix the problem but timing is delicate.

A shame about Belem! It seems to be THE place for natas!

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Just putting in a word for the West Island bagel of choice- Bagel de L’Ouest on Blvd. des Sources. As far as I know it’s one of only two out here with a full woodburning oven. St. Viateur opened up out here and they’re using a gas hybrid :anguished:

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Tea

As far as I know there are two main school of tea. The “European” school likes to flavour tea and blend them (the bergamot flavoured earl grey or the famous flavoured kusmi tea lines are examples.) The “Asian” school focuses on a single source and origin seems to be more important.

This distinction matters because a lot of our early tea parlours are were of the “Asian” persuasion. We do have European tea but a lot of focus is but of the Asian way of enjoying tea and a lot of my friends who are tea aficionados will focus on single source and origin over blends. I am not a tea aficionado myself but I tend to enjoy the European style much more.

Here are a few tea parlour and merchants that can provide interesting teas:

  • Camelia Sinensis: the elder statesman of the tea parlour. It is a boutique and a tea house. The boutique has a varied and extensive selection. They know their stuff, they are very serious and they are very passionate. The tea house is a bit weird. They have a “technology free zone” so you can’t use your laptop or phone. The clerk has a bell that he will ring if the atmosphere is too loud. It is a place designed and maintained for quiet discussions, meditative enjoyment of tea and calm reading. It is quite popular and is the antithesis of the “loud american” starbucks atmosphere. They also offer courses in their tea school and russian tea service on wednesday for 6$. see: http://camellia-sinensis.com/en/

  • Un amour de thé : I believe they were the second “new wave” tea shop I noticed after “Camelia Sinensis”. They have been there a while and are clearly knowledgeable and very passionate. I don’t think there is a tea parlour however. see: http://www.yelp.ca/biz/un-amour-des-thés-montréal-7

  • Ming Tao Xuan: A nice oldchool chinese tea house in the old montreal. They have a fine selection of tea pots and a lot of tea. They have a small space where you can sit and sample some of their products. see http://mingtaoxuan.com/index.html

  • Specialitea (Commerce Ming Wah Hong) this small teashop on the corner of Clark and René Levesque is probably my favourite in Chinatown. There might be better tea shops that I don’t know of but the sheer enthusiasm of the clerk that served us last time we were there really impressed us. On hearing my friends liked pu-erhs, he brewed samples and gave us a demonstration so involved that we could not leave his shop without buying something even if we didn’t come in looking to buy. It might look a bit “ghetto” to some but to me it looks authentic and charming See http://specialtea.ca/ or http://www.yelp.ca/biz/commerce-ming-wah-hong-montréal-3

  • Cha Noir: Looking for a tea house in Verdun? Cha Noir is a great little tea house where you can drink in a confortable atmosphere. http://www.cha-noir.com/en/

  • Kusmi: The famous french tea house has a brand store on the plateau. I think its the only store in Canada so enjoy! You can find Kusmi tea and most fine shops but you’ll find the best selection there. They make my favorite tea and offer sample boxes for you to try and make your mind. See: http://www.yelp.ca/biz/kusmi-montréal

  • David’s tea : To me, David’s tea sells tea for your colleague stuck in middle management in some random company. If Starbucks were to start a tea shop, David’s tea would be it. They are not bad by any mean but they are pretty mainstream and I would not count on them to have the institutional knowledge of a Camelia Sinensis even if they probably sell the same stuff at the same price. That being said, their customers probably don’t care that much either. A good entry level tea shop found in most shopping malls. https://www.davidstea.com/ca_en/winter-collection/view-all-winter-collection?gclid=CM2FkuGf7skCFQ2OaQod1nEPZQ#

  • Ritz Carlton: Looking for a place to enjoy english afternoon tea in high style? It doesn’t get more posh than at the Ritz Carlton. Yep, its pretty expensive (32$ per person… while you are there, why not enjoy a glass of champagne for 13$ more?) but you get the full experience in an authentic setting. They have been doing this since 1912 so they have plenty of institutional experience. see: http://www.ritzcarlton.com/en/Properties/Montreal/Dining/Afternoon-Tea/Default.htm

  • The Griffon d’Or Tea Room: Ok, I get it, you want the Edwardian afternoon tea tradition but you are not looking to spend Edwardian money for it. Worry not, I have a locally sourced hipsterish afternoon tea alternative to offer! At 25$ per person, you get teas, scones and sandwiches (please reserve 24/hr in advance). This tea room is very popular and has been getting great buzz. http://www.gryphondor.com/

  • Salon de Thé Cardinal : You looked at Griffon Tea Room and you think its a little bit out of the way. Salon de Thé Cardinal is more centrally located (not far from the plateau) and has plenty of vintage charm to boot. They offer afternoon tea too. http://www.thecardinaltea.com/

  • La maison tricotée : What? A place to knit AND drink tea? But they go so well together! I don’t knit myself but if I were to do so I’d give la maison tricotée a shot. http://www.yelp.ca/biz/la-maison-tricotée-montréal

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Iiish! Wouldn’t gaz hybrid take some flavours away?

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I definitely speak from my own experience. Know of some Hungarian coffee left? I never had Hungarian coffee and would be curious to try it.

I’ve yet to try San Simeon… I don’t go in little italy enough!

We do have a large diaspora! I remember there was an egyptian coffee and shisha shop called café nefertiti opened in the 90’s. That’s where I had my first taste of turkish coffee. Still have a bit of a hard time to get used to it. :smiley: