I didn’t use ad block on CH for a long time. Figured I was happy to deal with the ads and click occasionally as a way to help the site. Then they got greedy and started with the flashing ads, moving ads, obnoxious ads. So I installed ad block. If they had stayed with appropriately relevant ads that weren’t disruptive I would have gladly dealt with seeing them.
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eGullet did very well for a few years as a non-profit that took no ads but did encourage and accept donations. It’s still running, though there is not much activity on the boards I recently started following again there.
Any site that requires donations is going to force the less wealthy posters and those unwilling to voluntarily pay for a website off the site. I, for one, always considered my posts my contributions, and my feeling is, if some of you want to contribute, that’s great and I respect it, but this is something I do in my leisure time, and I have to save my money for things that are more important to my survival, maintenance and professional and familial responsibilities.
I’d add that I was off Chowhound for years after Leff tried to lecture people into contributing for the upkeep of his non-non-profit site, whose books he wouldn’t open.
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I assume you mean if the site asks for a fee, then it will force the less wealthy to pay.
In all honesty, I don’t see how a site can survive without ads. Most of us (me included) feel that “we are already contributing our knowledge, expertise, and time for free, and now you want money from us?” Moreover, if site A charges even $5 a month and site B charges nothing, then you will have a massive migration. Let’s just imagine between “HungryOnion” and “FoodTalkCentral”. Want to guess what will happen if FoodTakCentral asks for a monthly fee (even say $5)? A starting site (without a solid following and without a reputation) cannot charge fee.
Donation has the same problems, if not worse.
“Leff doesn’t get how this change is different. The changes that are making it harder for people to post in a regional-community-centric fashion are intended to bring in the clueless crowd to ask casual one-off questions”
“This is the core problem. This redesign is meant to chase off Hounds and bring in the less knowledgeable.”
Less knowledgeable than who? We can all learn from each other. I joined CH in 2001, I googled it. I asked a casual “one off” question and recieved really good info. Put it in my browser and was a reg. For many years.
Then, something happened and it seemed like folks started putting themselves on some kind of pedestal and questions from “the less knowledgeable” were treated with disdain. I saw new posters ask questions and they were pretty much dismissed. I remember one gal, she asked about fish tacos in …cant remember the place…anyway…she was told that they notice she had only posted to not about food…and she is still not asking about food.
While chowhoud may have lost a wealth of knowledge only to be replaced by less knowledgeable, at least there is room for growth. People that think they know everything cant learn anything and it becomes stagnant and not much fun.
I am very happy to be here. I like it here and am glad that newbies are welcomed regardless of knowledge or taste;)
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I frequent a wine site that has ads but, if you donate a minimum of $25 a year, you won’t see them. That seems to do the job for the site, and I’ve both subscribed and not subscribed at different times. Truth is that there aren’t enough ads, and they’re not intrusive enough, to make subscribing really all that valuable. It actually becomes more a thing of helping out the guy who started it. I have no idea what his cost structure is or if he’s making out on it.
With our current scale, the ongoing monthly costs is equivalent to a small pizza.
Let’s say if we are very fortunate to scale to 25x of where we are now, i believe the monthly costs can be kept to a mid-range dinner with wine, tax, and tips.
What does that mean? There is a benefit of running a tight ship where costs really are not a concern. You can, however, order me a pizza when I am working on the site late at night. 
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Hey man, if you’re visiting New York, let me know, and I’d be happy to take you out for a good whiskey or rye, if you like those kinds of drinks.
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You may not see how a site can survive without ads, but eGullet did for years.
And no, a site that requires a fee simply won’t have people on the site who are unable or unwilling to pay a fee - for example, me. There isn’t a single website I’d pay a fee for, except for maybe the College Music Society, for their job announcements (but I’ve let my membership lapse - I suppose I should pay up, but my point is made: I have to benefit professionally or at least have the clear and unique possibility of benefitting professionally to be willing to pay for access to a site)
while paying for a full time director too.
Yep. (“Yep” wasn’t allowed for not being at least 5 characters.)
minimum post length changed to 2.
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CH has great google presence and will survive as long as someone who left raw chicken in the trunk for three days and wonders if it is edible or was offended by the silverware placement at their diner find their way there.
I think the redesign really missed the mark by eliminating the regional boards which even though I did not participate much in them were sort of the whole point of the place remedying that alone, a fairly easy fix, would have won them many points.
I don’t think they care about loosing long time users I am sure they are confident that they will continue to attract new ones - and they will but without a good community those new posters won’t likely stay long.
OTOH HO will need to build its profile to attract new blood in order to avoid becoming just a refugee camp. Been through that once before from another board and while the offshoot forum still exists 5 years later it is not nearly as active as the original big, evil, over moderated forum but that one has also lost some of its buzz
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My own opinion is that the technology changes are not the big issues that some folks make them out to be and, in fact, some of it may well be a positive factor in CH growth. The major issue for me is that the new look/feel of the site is meant to attract a different type of person than that of the old (especially the very old) CH. Specifically, its meant to attract folks who want to ask where a “yummy” place to go is & not those interested in finding places & discussing their merits. TripAdvisor and Yelp stuff. So, yes, I too don’t think they care about losing long time users… most of us aren’t what they’re after and we eat up lots of space with our wordy insights and back & forth comments & interest in community…. and I think its a deliberate business plan. That being said, I’ll be there probably the way I’m on TA. But I prefer and will contribute to places where discussion is key, not 20 character proclamations.
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Funny you say that because a few days ago I noticed ads for football on CH (or something about football - didn’t pay attention). I found it odd and didn’t recall seeing that before. It could just be that ads are front and center on almost every page/click now, but it made me wonder if they were trying to court the beer/wings/frat crowd. I know there are plenty of CH threads asking for recommendations re: beer and pub food, but it reminded me of being on espn.com.
I am not sure the new CH team doesn’t care about old members leaving. Last night I went on an old CH thread and advised a few old friends about the Onion & today I got an email from the CH Team threatening my membership.
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Admittedly, I was over-generalizing a bit & they’re not exactly asking for us old CH folk to leave. However, I also wouldn’t generalize that they want your friends to stay vs. just not wanting you to hand out flyers for a new market while standing in the lobby of the old one next door. 
nah – we’ve talked about eGullet and Mouthsful and epicurious for years – the current threats and banishments is a straight-up reaction to mention of Hungry Onion and Food Talk Central. Threads get locked, posts, are removed, and people are getting nastygrams for mentioning the “exile” websites – mentions of the first three above don’t even get a shrug.
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Man, so we are really treated as if we as if some kind of threats…
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Not that I’d want to give anyone any ideas… but I’ve seen a topic mentioning HO and FTC on CH that’s lasted several days buried under a city tag.
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Your right, quite a few Hounds were members of many food related sites and talked about them from time to time on CH and there was never an issue that I know of. I think its healthy and brings more insight to the table which seems to me to be what CH was all about.
I changed my internet provider a couple years ago and tried to find the format to notify CH of the address change but couldn’t find it. My membership still worked with the new provider but I just didn’t receive any email from the CH Administrators. No big deal I thought.
After the big site change I posted several pieces critical of the change & those responsible for it. I was then suspended but didn’t know it because the CH Admin message went to my old email which no longer existed.
The sign on message I got said something like “invalid email address or improper password” .
I figured CH’s new software finally picked up on the inactive e-mail address and purged me.
I then re-sign up using my current e-mail address and proceed to very quietly notify some of our old friends about the Onion. Several hours later I receive an E-Mail from Marcela & the CH Team that I am permanently suspended for spamming the “Onion” & for creating a second account while my original account was under temporary suspension.
I responded by explaining the email address change problem & that I did not get any of their warnings & thought I was purged because of an inactive e-mail address.
I have not heard back from them & really don’t expect to. 
